Is this legit Mutable gear?

#1

Checking in before buying, but this store on Reverb has brand new modules it says are Mutable brand - but for a lot less money - are these supported? Just a bit cautious as that seems a crazy price for new Marbles and Plaits

This is the store https://reverb.com/shop/momo-modular

#2

Nope, the designs are, but the production is not.

Really frustrating to see plaits, stages and marbles undercut like that. Especially since plaits is already such an incredible value for a legit build. At least the “monsoon” is a redisign with additional parameters available on the panel.

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#3

You’re certainly not going to get any support from me if you have an issue with one of these lol

Simple rule: if it doesn’t look like the stuff shown on the Mutable Instruments website, it’s not legit. Cramped panels redesigned to fit 6 HP, weird fonts, non Rogan knobs = ewwww.

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#4

It’s really sad people abuse the gift of the open source designs… (makes me feel sad)

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#5

:sob:

How about a 3x the price of a Rings because ‘buchla format’ abuse?

https://1979.ws/digital-resonator/

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#6

egads - guy is selling hundreds of them. Also turns out he isn’t even an engineer as he claims - sad he would deceive people like that

#7

What’s in a name?

2. a person who operates or is in charge of an engine.

I would say “at least this required firmware modifications”, but I can’t say I understand what would appear to be CV control of ‘poly’ and ‘type’?

A one screenshot summary of why I’ll continue to support direct MI sales*:

*Unless I feel particularly compelled to DIY (that being ‘do-it-myself’, not ‘do-it-other-self’, or potentially most troubling ‘do-it-robot-self-deceptively-represented-as-other-self’)

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#8

He says he is an Electronics Engineer with 10 years experience - he’s actually a 24-year old statistics grad

#9

Well, you know… he could have graduated from Electronic Engineering school at 14. before embarking on his Statistics degree…

:wink:

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#10

:joy::joy::joy:

#11

That doesn’t compete with any MI products that are currently for sale, and there is some value-adding in adapting it for the Buchla 1.2V/oct standard and different trigger voltages etc. And the “Buchla tax” is driven more by what Buchlaistas are willing to pay rather than by any imposed tax or surcharge. Thus, I don’t think it is in any way problematic.

Likewise selling clones of discontinued MI modules seems fine to me, provided that they are clearly marked as clones and not presented as being endorsed or supported by MI. Alas, not all clone sellers take care to do that.

Personally, I draw the ethical line at commercial sales of clones of MI modules which are currently being sold. That includes all the “micro” versions of current MI modules. Such practices would seem to directly compete with MI.

What about people who make DIY clones of current MI modules for personal use, but who don’t sell them to others (not even as second-hand when no longer required)? I fall into that category, or at least, I have in the past. That’s more of a grey area (at least, that’s what I tell myself, with astounding hypocrisy). Does it deprive MI of sales? Yes, partially. I cannot say that I would never have bought any MI modules had I not DIYed clones of MI modules. Thus the distinction is with respect to the magnitude of the “competition” such DIY-as-substitution-for-purchases represents. Any ethicist will tell you that’s an invalid basis for a distinction.

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#12

I’m curious, what’s your opinion of the Buchla format? I often find myself wishing the format were a little taller, and I know that cramped panel designs are a bit of a pet peeve. Have you ever thought about branching out into 4U?

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#13

Isn’t enough way to create original modules instead of stoling Emilie’s work?

#14

I’m pretty much in the same boat as BennelongCyclist, I’ve also diyed a lot of MI modules but I think I have bought more factory modules because of it. Likewise I would never sell one. I bought some modules on the basis of trying out in vcvrack. Also the fact that I could look at the code and schematics helped make buying decisions… Although I have built many many of the modules I still buy factory modules occasionally where I might not otherwise as an “honour” type of thing. About half of my fun (at least !) in modular synthesis is now in the diy side and playing with code and schematics. It’s led me to design my own modules, based on the schematics, and also to get back into developing code (currently working on a new module - not derived from anything else). All of this is or will be (when ready) open source. This all wouldn’t have happened without schematics and layouts available to learn from.

I also make a regular donation to charity as per Emilie’s request… so, for me, the free and open (in the sense of information) has helped make my buying decisions as well as given me a lot of enjoyment in playing with electronics and code again…

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#15

If someone was to gift me a bunch of Buchla stuff (I’d possibly prefer Serge) I wouldn’t grumble but for the life of me, I don’t see the insane prices as being terribly reflective of their value, particularly when there are so many technical issues/build quality issues and idiosyncracies. I mean, chips are chips and resistors are resistors within reason, they aren’t squirting a secret sauce made of molten unicorn tears and platinum butterflies into the products or anything. (Generalising here but) I also can’t help feel that the cost of admission engenders a bit of an elitist attitude where the merest hint that the proles might be getting access to something based on west coast and the emperor’s clothes might be getting a little more transparent causes outrage - see things like Arturia easel clone and the korg modular threads on muffs as an example.

Don’t get me wrong though, I’m not a hater, there are loads of Charles Cohen, Mort Subotnick etc. Buchla albums that I listen to lots and thoroughly enjoy, I just know there’s no way I could ever justify spending 6 grand on an easel.

While someone like adam scrabbling around for a few £s a pop with the boards he’s done little more than download from github and sent away to china to have printed is gross, there’s something that also doesn’t quite sit right with me about ‘adaptations’ with such an insanely high markup, particularly when the original intent was for education just seems pretty stinky (have also seen the person behind them getting into a big outrage and accusing someone of ‘stealing’ his digital drawing of a standard davies knob on modulargrid and using it on their own mockup panel over pages and pages which just seems, pfffft to me).

All just my uninformed opinion though and probably not worth the pepper they are sneezed upon.

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#16

I remember that thread. Incredibly embarassing how he got all worked up about the “theft”
Wont buy any of his stuff for that reason.

#17

I like the model Random Source has with their Serge modules that are available for DIY. Having Serge on board and in a creative role is a huge plus. And the quality of the panels is fantastic. Same with things like Frequency Central, where you can have the DIY option. But sticking a panel on a full-size Plaits just seems borderline theft and fraud. Especially if one is selling high volumes and probably doesn’t have the customer service to handle things that go wrong

#18

Sorry, I don’t want to derail the topic. I would agree the “Buchla Tax,” is definitely an anachronism and I think even Buchla USA would agree with that given the launch of the Red Panel series.

I just meant that I like the 4U form factor. I was just wondering if there is room in the world for MI modules in that scale. Thinking upon it further, I am likely thinking of a new format that is 4U tall but still basically eurorack in terms of patching and voltages (although I agree banana cables are cool).

As a side note, I think it’s pretty funny that rather than make use of the extra space, the 1979.ws module takes the opportunity to squeeze two braids into the module. It’s the 4U equivalent of a uModule.

#19

Check your math…

It’s mostly about economies of scale (or lack thereof).

But that’s in Eurorack…

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#20

Their version of Marbles is hideous. A lot of these designs don’t do the modules justice at all. Admittedly, I had a uBurst at one time to try and be space conscious, but then sold it and bought a factory Clouds with new appreciation of the full size. Only non-factory MI module I ever had.

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